RE: New First Page! Only Different!

[Xuor]

I just read this entire thread, and I am downloading HTML Builder XP as I type, but a few things I had to say-
(BTW, now that Admin closed the original thread, I had to start this one)

I think it VERY rude that Admin removed all of the links to HBXP. Here is the link for HBXP: http://www.******************/

Also, I found it by Googling for "HTML Builder XP" (that sidenote in case Admin deletes the URL again.).

Frankly, Admin, if you don't like people advertising HBXP, then finish FP3 and have a better product!! (I'm sorry, but I think that that is only fair. Be willing to take pressure from your competition.)

While I REALLY like the idea of a free FP3, considering that I am as poor as a church mouse, I am willing to pay for either FP3 or HBXP (the paid version), providing of course that they are high-enough quality.

Currently, I no longer use FP2000, the main reason being that FP does not include PHP extensions in the file browser on the left. Instead, I use AceHTML, which works very well, but still not really up to FP's standard.

I guess that I don't really have as much to say as I thought that I did :D , but that will suffice for now. If I come up with more, then I will post more!

Sayanara! (sp?)

[Xuor]

http://www.******************/


EDIT:

As apparently Admin has a script set up to eliminate Code Builder links, I guess that to find your Code Builder you will just have to Google for "HTML Builder XP", although I am going to try this, anyway:

www.******************

[Hunkah]

It is sad really, he put in a "last words" then locked it!!!

After reading through this entire thread and reading the chat conversation between dbindel and GrimReaper(Chris), I am truely sadden to see the way Chris has seized upon the opportunity to bad mouth myself and in return advertise his company. One example of this is requesting our moderator to delete/modify my threads to advertise his company. There was a reason why I no longer work with my old partner and it's obvious why.

Also, one thing I can assure you is that once 1st Page 3 is out, a few months later you will see all the features duplicated and copied to HTML builder.
This is such bull crap!!! Chris didn't do anything but enlighten us to the reason HTML Builder looked so much like 1st page! Then offered us some info on who everyone was!!! He never bashed Nipple at all!!! In fact it was Nipple that started with the insults! We asked questions, Chris answered them. We asked Nipple for over two years to give us a simple hello, but he just ignored us!!! Frig HIM!
And besides, who cares who comes up with the ideas, software is supposed to be built upon, you have an idea then I have one, then fred down the street has one! We all build on each others ideas! That is how we have done it for our whole existance!!! We don't reinvent the wheel, we make cars now!!! I don't get where he thinks HTML is his!!! KING FRIGGIN NIPPLE!!! Let us all praise NIPPLE! He is the only one allowed to write software, and to be the only one that is allowed to ignore people!!! Alright enough out of me! :-X

[Xuor]

Now that I have showed everyone how to get HTML Builder XP, I though that I should give people my opinion of it, so that you can decide whether to go with it, FirstPage 2000, or another program (such as AceHTML). I will tell you right off the bat that I am continuing to use Ace, but am hoping that HBXP will be improved soon.

(And yes, I will post this to the HBXP forums as well, once I have a little more extra time :) )

My problems with HBXP are as follows (pretty much at least):


Advertising (I fully understand Chris's want to put in advertising, but one of the things I hate the most in the world is ads. They are fine in this program, except for the little window along the bottome of the editing window. I draw the line there.)

File Browser - - My problem here is that the File Manager bar on the left, while it displays .PHP files, unlike FP, double-clicking those files opens them in their associated program. Even if this program is HBXP, they open up in an entire new copy of the program, instead of being added to the list of currently open files in the current copy.

Tab stops- The tab stops feature seems to make the stops almost completely arbitrary. The 4th or 5th tab stop on a line will jump you about 5 tabs, not 1.

Gray line-This is reminiscent of FP-There is a gray line down the middle-right of my screen. This line is presumably there so that I can drag it left or right to control the extent of word wrap, but the line doesn't move. I used to kind of have this problem with FP-when I would resize things (this line for example) I would get "ghosting".

Left-side bar--You can't completely hide the left-side bar by "minimizing" it through clicking the little arrow thingy. Part of it still shows on the screen.

Spelling--This is a problem that REALLY bugs me--misspellings. While I can't remember any actually in the FP program off of the top of my head, HBXP has several misspellings embedded in the program: Oh man!!! Now I just checked the program looking for the problems I know are there, and I can't find them!! (crawls away in shame...)

However, I CAN point out problems on the website of HBXP- on the download page, he spells "below", "belew", and in his "Just-Hosting" ad, he misspells "separate". I know there are others, but I'm not reallly remembering them at the moment :hmmm: (Grins ashamedly...) Spelling and grammar, when written down incorrectly, DRIVE ME UP THE WALL!!!! Spoken, it isn't so bad, but written?!!!?!?!?!?


The main (really pretty much one and only) reason I switched to Ace after after FP was because of the file-bar. If HBXP would fix that problem alone, then I would probably switch over to them, though it would be apreciated if the whole program were updated a little first.

I KNOW that I would switch back to FP if that were the only problem that was fixed! That one is the only reason I left!


As far as Hunkah's post... I have to say that I disagree with your way of putting things. I agree with your content, just not your delivery. I think that we ALL (pretty much everyone, at least), could work on being a little more polite regarding Admin. I mean, Come On!! The guy ONLY wrote FP!!! How many of YOU could write that whole program from scratch?? I know I couldn't. I might be able to make an HTML editor with VB or VC (if I learned a little more C first), but it would be NOWHERE near the quality of FP. FP RULES!

However, I am not justifying Admin. I think that he is showing very poor sportsmanship. He should be at least a little more gracious in his dealing with the rest of us.

All for now.... Signing off...

EDIT- Eliminated a problem that I found out how to fix. Added 3 HBXP complaints to replace the one I removed.

[Xuor]

Ok, NOW I'm feeling stupid. :p After my last few posts, I decided to really check into FP and see if I could modify it anywhere to change the side-bar file-explorer filters. Although the options to do so DON'T work. (Trust me, I spent quite some time trying to modify them.) by setting the filter to "All files *.*", I can make it work. The problem, I think, has something to do with the php extension, or maybe my computers, because "*.php" is in the accepted extension list, yet does not show up.

So.., once again this devoted code monkey is using FirstPage 2000, the ONE, the ONLY! Although I will be checkin the HBXP site every now and then, for now, I am using FirstPage 2000. I do have to say though, I would REALLY apreciate having the word wrap fix published in a new version of FP.

Admin, I (and everyone else in this forum) would really apreciate it if you could release just a quick bug fix for FP 2000 - namely, the word wrap fix. I think that even the slightest indication of interest on your part in FP would bring people FLOCKING back to FP. You don't have to publish the full FP3 yet (though that would certainly be apreciated, as well ;) ), just the word wrap fix.

Xuor

[DCElliott]

Xuor

Some extremely good points, stick around, we need yah.

Napoleon (Admin): consider very carefully Xuor's recommendation that a word-wrap bux-fix release be offered (without the six-buttons scripts as well, if you please). I have no idea how hard it would be to do this, fixing the bug may not be that difficult, but then there is the recompile and redoing the installer and uploading and and . . .

This might cause a resurge in interest in FP which in many folks opinion remains the most useful freeware editor on the planet.

And Xuor - we'd welcome you back if you get tired of NY state.

DE

[Xuor]

Thanks DCElliot :) I appreciate your comments. I'll do my best to stick around, although I have a habit of wandering away from forums after contributing for a while. :-D

As far as Canada is concerned- I'm 50% Canadian and 50% American, but frankly, I LOVE Canada! For now, there are various reasons which prohibit me from living in Canada, but someday, it is my dream to live in Canada. (New Brunswick or Nova Scotia, perhaps? :) )

Xuor

[AMP]

Ditto's to Xuor! I agree with all the points made on 3-29.

BTW, has anybody played with TSW WebCoder (http://www.tsware.net/download.php4)? Not as powerful an editor as 1stP, but very similar in function and appearance. I like it's clean interface and Office XP style menus (NOT big ugly WinXP buttons). It's a visually pleasing editor that's a strong contender.

It also has some nice features that 1stP doesn't, such as the "Image Explorer", and "Quick Edit" (Simple WYSIWYG that is great for working with text, and creates clean code). If you create very large tables, you'll like the dynamic resizing of the graphical table creator. I like the FTP utility being integrated into the sidebar too.

WebCoder also has an extensive HTML4, CSS, JavaScript, VBScript, & PHP4 library. You'll also appreciate the 'true' full-screen viewing mode and "QuickPreview". I'd really like to see all these features in 1stP2003.

You might also want to check out PSPad (http://www.sw.cz/pspad/index_en.html). It's an excellent lightweight text/Hex/HTML editor and requires no installation. A great alternative to Notepad for viewing webpage's source code from IE's "View" menu or right-click option (Netscape has a nice basic source viewer built-in) .

[melvis]

I am not a regular in this forum. I drop in every 2 or 3 months out of curiosity. I really don't care anymore if Evrsoft publishes a new version of their software. I was a fan of 1P2000 and recommended it to several novice friends a couple of years ago.

Not anymore. As far as I am concerned the developers have moved on to other interests and simply do not have the courtesy to tell the community. Whatever.

Myself, I have switched to CodeCharge. My developing efforts have evolved into more complex sites which really benefit from a script supporting IDE. For minor coding tweaks, I'll just drop into a text editor. I haven't even had a copy of 1P2000 for over 12 months.

There are so many alternate tools out there. They all have strengths and weaknesses. Find one and move on, this horse is dead.

[AMP]

I exchanged e-mails with WebCoder's developer, Kasper. He has done a great job with TSW WebCoder (http://www.tsware.net/download.php4). It has real-time (every 5 seconds or 10 keystrokes) preview, just make sure you set how often to refresh the preview pane (right-click in "Edit" pane). It doesn't refresh automatically by default so at first it appears like it doesn't work, but it does. It took me a while to figure it out.

You super coders may scoff at WYSIWYG, but I find WebCoder's simple ActiveX-based WYSIWYG great for those super quick edits (esp. redundant text formatting). It's certainly NOT for extended use, but if you need to whip up a page really fast, it helps.

V3 was released over 7 months ago, Sept, 05 '02. Kasper said that V4 is due out in a few months so I'm anxious to see the new enhancements. I'm switching to WebCoder for now. I'm still a 'beginning' web designer, so it works just fine for me, but it should meet the needs of much more demanding coders as well.

The only drawback to Webcoder is the lack of a hlep file but everything's so similar to 1stPage that it's pretty easy to figure out. It's also a very intuitive interface.

We'll see if 1stP2003 ever materialises! I hope so. It was an original and way ahead of its time.

WebCoder Home: http://www.tsware.net/

[descentr]

Originally posted by Hunkah
[B]It is sad really, he put in a "last words" then locked it!!![B]

Yeah, it says a lot about his character I think. However, this is his board and there are still several references to competing products that he has left. Though whether this is due to his good will or lack of effort is not clear.
Originally posted by Admin Also, one thing I can assure you is that once 1st Page 3 is out, a few months later you will see all the features duplicated and copied to HTML builder.[/i]
That bastard!! How dare he copy interface and features from other programs like FP2K did (as most programmers do). How dare he actually interact with his/your users and actually release code in a timely manner. I'd much rather it be managed the way FP2K has been for the last 3 years.

descentr

[milkydoo]

Originally posted by 5TillFree
You super coders may scoff at WYSIWYG, but I find WebCoder's simple ActiveX-based WYSIWYG great for those super quick edits (esp. redundant text formatting). It's certainly NOT for extended use, but if you need to whip up a page really fast, it helps.
There's nothing wrong with visual tools; it's really a matter of preference, and of course, the quality of the tool itself makes a huge difference.

Before 1P2K, I used Symantec's Visual Page, which came with my Norton System Works 2000 package. I really liked that tool, and could knock out pages quick. The only reason why I left is because Symantec stopped supporting it and its' HTML and CSS standards were a little out of date, plus it had a couple of bothersome bugs.

I use 1P2K because, at the time I got it, it was the only free tool with decent features that I could find. About a year ago, I tried the Dreamweaver demo, and good God, it was awesome! I'm saving up for it now.

Dreamweaver is a hybrid, and that is what makes it great; you have the best of both worlds.

I'm going to check out the other visual tools mentioned here, 'cause I really dislike pure hand coding.....and there are some bugs in 1P2K that are really starting to get to me.

The 'holier than thou' hand coder mindset really gets tiresome after awhile. Knocking out 1000 page site in notepad really does not impress me. It's about preference, ease of use for the individual, comfort and visualization preference. If visual tools didn't make it easier for a lot of people to get work done, then they simply wouldn't be popular.

[Z_Go]

I just recently downloaded WebCoder 5 and I was just wondering how go about activating the word wrap function. Also how do you turn off the automatic fill-in function when you're typing code and want to type in the whole thing yourself instead having it guess what you intend to type.

Thanks.

[Terminator1138]

since this forum is mainly 1st page, I'm not sure about Webcoder 5 functions. I think some here have tried it. Maybe PM those in this thread that have tried it like 5TillFree or something. You might get a quicker answer.