Tanja Baumann

[John Aarsen]

Hello all forum members,

I would welcome any views, opinions & suggestions for improvements to www.tanjabaumann.com.
The site started out as a framed site (from Jan to April), has been fully redesigned twice since then & is now - I hope - ready for dmoz submission.
I still have to sharpen up individual page keywords - & get more links! - so any other viewpoints would be appreciated.

Cheers,
John

[Note: advertisement has been removed, it wasn't considered appropriate to post here.]

[Daybreak_0]

Well based on the advertisement I just had to look :-)

1) Not sure why you have my IP address on front page, saying "Hi, 111.111.111.111". Many would not understand let alone know what their number was.

2) I found the page a bit too busy for my liking - links all over the place, and no real clue where to click first. When I did decide to go somewhere I got a bit lost.

If the intention is to get business out of this site, then I would have started with what you had at bottom "I believe in the natural way to health & fitness. Fitness should be fun & enjoyable - a part etc etc" with the picture you have now.

Then a small explanation of the services you offer -

and thirdly, a section with links to
All Services
Contact
Background
Awards
Search
etc

but not too much more - You want to make the site easy to navigate, and not hit the user/potential client with all the information at one time.

3) Something funny with the front page when resizing. The picture gets pushed down the page - could not see why, because for some reason my browser refuses to let me see source on any page today.

Apart from that I can't complain - the pictures were good!

Day

[bigdawg]

too much going on pluss I cannot read switzerland

[tmmoose]

Can't say I care for the choice of colour...has the appearance
of a newspaper flyer insert.......other than that it works fine......to each his own...

[MikeParent]

I must say, that it strikes me as a bit "odd" to include "cheesecake" shots of one's self if one is hoping to be taken seriously (don't get me wrong , I am appreciative, but...). Perhaps there is a cultural difference thing at play here.

In any case, the colours are displeasing to me, as is the border around the site... it reminds me of many spam type sites that I have seen. Pink is a hard colour to get away with using and still look professional.

I can't imagine anyone with half a brain using the "fitness google search". I would nuke it.

Again, with the professionalism, too much use of goofy effects like mouse cursor images, fireworks animations, etc.

[John Aarsen]

Hello all,
Sorry for the delay in replying, the last couple of weeks have been hectic.

To: Daybreak_0
Thanks for your well-reasoned & clear-eyed view & proposal to match. Really made me think anew, which was what I was looking for.
To reply, a few facts about the Swiss Fitness Market:
a) 16% of the population is a member of a fitness gym / studio. This is the highest membership level in the world.
b) Tanja is a household name in Switzerland & has appeared literally dozens of times on TV & radio & in newspapers & magazines during the past seven years.
c) All site figures quoted cover the period July 14 to Oct. 13 this year.

1. The IP address is an attempt to personalise the visitor experience. I understand from published sources that in The Netherlands & Switzerland most people do know their own IP address & I felt that it would give a positive "oh, they know I'm here" effect. Can't measure results, but I don't see any complaints in the e-mails.
It has had one unplanned & very welcome effect - no more dirty, grubby-minded e-mails! Some horrible people out there.
2. Yes, it was indeed too busy - I think I had a fixation with keyword link phrases at the time. Have toned down the page & the text links more or less reflect the navigation bar text now.
3. The fitness philosophy only went in 3 days before your posting - at this stage I'm not changing the emphasis but give me a little time.
4. The site goals are:

A. To supply Tanja's fans in Switzerland with the material(s) they want. This translates into pictures, films, titles, achievements etc. in an easily recognisable view - which is the reason for the magazine-type layout with image on each page. The layout is "familiar" to the Swiss, who have seen her often in this type of layout.
B. To generate "real-world" business for Tanja in Switzerland:
- personal fitness trainer new clients: 9 of the last 10 through the site.
- new clients for Tanja's fitness & health academy workouts - kids dance workouts 300% increase in clients, adult workouts 25% increase in clients
- new business clients - 2 new "special event" clients
C. To function as Tanja's communication point with the fitness community, both locally & internationally.

The very diversity of the site goals makes your "content list" approach very interesting. Give me some time to see if I can make something of it.

[John Aarsen]

hello bigdawg

Yes - see my reply to Day. By the way, Switzerland is a country, not a language & the site language is "en-gb".

[John Aarsen]

Hello tmmoose,
Pink is Tanja's favourite colour & the site reflects this. Again, many of Tanja's public appearances in Switzerland seem to involve pink so it's, like the magazine layout, familiar to Swiss people.

[John Aarsen]

mike parent

1. What absolute nonsense. I don't recollect a single poster in the recent California election which didn't feature Arnold's face & nobody found it "odd". Apparantly the vast majority of Californian voters didn't find it "odd" that Arnold made use of his instant recognition & they certainly took him seriously, which is precisely what Tanja enjoys in Switzerland. No cultural thing here at all.

2. Your "I am appreciative" comment is merely stupidly sexist. If I had been a woman I do not believe that you would have placed this comment. In any case, methinks thou doth protest too much.

3. Your clear expertise in spam sites is your business - I would not know where to find them, let alone view them. Designers should work - as far as possible - with the communication tools available to them. In this instance, both the colour & the layout made use of known elements in Tanja's perception by the Swiss public. Personal preferences should never get in the way of optimum communication - so you get in there, use pink & make it work. Right through to testing it at the Lighthouse for people with eye diseases. As far as "Look professional" is concerned - I've always found that he who starts wielding the "professional stick" is generally a frustrated individual as nobody is interested in his / her definition of professionalism.

4. "I can't imagine anyone with half a brain using the "fitness google search". Your sheer rudeness beggars belief. Read - & learn - from the W3c & Jakob Nielsen about site search & the need for it.

5. "Again with the professionalism" -
Confucius, a wise, real professional once said (appoximately, read a long time ago):
He who knows not & asks because he knows not, is hungry for knowledge - teach him.
He who knows not & knows not that he does not know, is innocent - guide him.
He who knows not & asks not because he does not know, is a fool - shun him.
6. As children form a major part of Tanja's business - & protested loudly when I pulled off the roll-over images a couple of months ago - I will trust my instinct to satisfy the kids & give them what they want.

To end: John Kenneth Galbraith taught us that the net belongs to the people - not to the governments, so-called professionals etc.

[bigdawg]

Country, I knew, I was being facicious!! my wife was here and we were running out the door and i asked her quickly do u know what language they speak in Switzerland. No harm intended she is from Mexico.

[John Aarsen]

hi bigdawg,

no harm taken, I assure you.
Question - have you got a big dog?
Judy & I have 3 dogs + 2 cats & Bear is the largestdog - Tatra (Polish mountain dog), 60 kg. - & it's all love.

cheers,
john

[bigdawg]

This page was written as though by my dog and can be found in the links drop dron menu at either site http://www.bigdawgcaps.com and http://www.latinagear.com John give me some feedback on the Sachmo page you can also submit a photo of your pet. BTW he is a Jack Russell Terrier but he thinks he is a big dog

[Daybreak_0]

John

I would make another suggestion - either a new font, or get rid of the style itallic.

Because the style is italic it is quite rough/jagged to look at and It distracts the viewer. You could create an image for Tanja's name if you wanted to keep the itallic.

Not sure there is a good font that looks ok in Itallic.

I read you point about the search and WC3, did not know that -thanks. I would myself move the search to the footer, or provide a search page using a link, as my point would be to get my information across first. Also helps remove some of the busy look.

Day

[bigdawg]

I would suggest leaving the border around her photo and her name can be in pink However the rest should go. Her clientele will identify with her favorite color but to OD on it is overkill. Would look a whole lot classier this way

[MikeParent]

Wow John, if that was the edited version, I would have loved to have seen the unedited :-)

Obviously I hit a nerve here. Perhaps you should get over yourself a little and how frightfully clever you obviously think you are (based on your pretentious use of vocabulary and the condescending tone of your response). I guess since you know everything you didnt really need my input, but be advised that if you're going to put yourself out there for a critique you have to be prepared for some of the tough love that ultimately may ensue.

Originally posted by John Aarsen
1. What absolute nonsense. I don't recollect a single poster in the recent California election which didn't feature Arnold's face & nobody found it "odd". Apparantly the vast majority of Californian voters didn't find it "odd" that Arnold made use of his instant recognition & they certainly took him seriously, which is precisely what Tanja enjoys in Switzerland. No cultural thing here at all.


Well. First of all I live in Canada and did not follow this election. So I will have to take your word on this. Not sure why it would interest you all the way over in the Netherlands. In any case, do you recall any near-nude shots of Arnold smiling provactively at the camera? No? Why do you suppose that is? Your comparison is mildly flawed. Now I understand posting some shots of this woman in her posedowns and competitions, etc. I really do. But there seems to be an overabundance of these photographs, and they dont all seem to be merely fitness related (the word cheesecake keeps creeping back - its the only apt word I can think of).

- I would like to submit the following as exhibit A (http://www.tanjabaumann.com./fitness-aerobic-aerobics-images/btba09ab.jpg)).


2. Your "I am appreciative" comment is merely stupidly sexist. If I had been a woman I do not believe that you would have placed this comment. In any case, methinks thou doth protest too much.


An admittedly lame attempt at injecting a bit of levity in what I knew to be a bit of a brutal (though I believe accurate) assessment of your site. Perhaps I was cranky that day and did not temper my comments as I should have but my assessment stands. Incidentally since you obviously do not know me, I will assure you that I absolutely would still have made that comment.


3. Your clear expertise in spam sites is your business - I would not know where to find them, let alone view them.


I guess that was supposed to be insulting. My browser has popups, I get spam email... whatever.


Designers should work - as far as possible - with the communication tools available to them. In this instance, both the colour & the layout made use of known elements in Tanja's perception by the Swiss public. Personal preferences should never get in the way of optimum communication - so you get in there, use pink & make it work. Right through to testing it at the Lighthouse for people with eye diseases.

Wasnt the choice to use pink to begin with a personal preference of the client? I guess you have to respect the client's wishes, but the other posts bear out that I am not alone in this. Perhaps it can be used more as an accent colour.

As far as "Look professional" is concerned - I've always found that he who starts wielding the "professional stick" is generally a frustrated individual as nobody is interested in his / her definition of professionalism.


Oh please. Look, I get paid very well to do what I do. I offer advice, you can choose to ignore if you like. Whatever. Believe me when I say I am not losing any sleep over this, nor am I frustrated. (lol)


4. "I can't imagine anyone with half a brain using the "fitness google search". Your sheer rudeness beggars belief. Read - & learn - from the W3c & Jakob Nielsen about site search & the need for it.


Indeed.

"For unknown reasons, many websites feel compelled to offer a search-engine feature that allows users to choose whether to search the current site or the entire Internet. This is a bad idea. People know where to find a web-wide search engine; these sites are the most used service on the Web. There is no need to clutter up your interface with one more option that has so little utility"

Jakob Neilsen: Designing Web Usability (the sidebar on Page 224 to be exact).


As it happens I own many books on web development and design. FWIW Jakob Neilsen has lots of good ideas and observations, but not everyone agrees with all of them...


5. "Again with the professionalism" -
Confucius, a wise, real professional once said (appoximately, read a long time ago):
He who knows not & asks because he knows not, is hungry for knowledge - teach him.
He who knows not & knows not that he does not know, is innocent - guide him.
He who knows not & asks not because he does not know, is a fool - shun him.


Remind me again which one am I? Oh right the last one... again with the insults. Tsk tsk. My poor fragile feelings.

I am looking for relevancy here... So enlighten me oh wise one, just exactly what am I ignorant of? Is this site not a marketing tool for a professional?


6. As children form a major part of Tanja's business - & protested loudly when I pulled off the roll-over images a couple of months ago - I will trust my instinct to satisfy the kids & give them what they want.


Point conceded. Now about those animated fireworks...


To end: John Kenneth Galbraith taught us that the net belongs to the people - not to the governments, so-called professionals etc. [/B]

Uh huh. I see your point. Let me see if I can rephrase it for you. "I will ask your opinion, but bugger off if you actually know what you're talking about."

If you didnt want criticism, don't ask for it. We're not all here to tell you how much your site "rocks", or some such.

(edit: blockquoted Jakob Neilsen quote)

[bigdawg]

You can either type super fast or have time on your hands but I did read your post and it was funny and honest at the same time. I agree with most of all your points except the search engine thing. I have put google on mine twofold I use different browsers and did not put it there to say that people do not know where to find a search engine. Secondly I can set my home page to my site and use that browser for debugging or checking links etc so partly it is selfish. I will take your opinion into account and do a re-think on it but if you notice anything about my site is I do not approve of spam or chessy links etc and do think the google looks good with a couple of modifications I did.

[MikeParent]

If you double-check the times you'll see I took a few hours :-)

Hey to each his own. I just thought it ironic that John suggested I could fill a gap in my knowledge using a source that actually supports my argument in the first place.

Using the Google search technology for your own site search engine is a great idea. Beats writing one yourself (and the commercial ones can get very pricey). I just don't see offering the choice of the web to be of much value. In John's site I also (mis?)interpreted it as a search of only fitness sites, which is even less useful IMO.

[bigdawg]

Actually the one I am useing is free to search the web. I do not believe that my site will grow to the point of needing to search within itself. http://www.latinagear.com

[animgirl]

There are some photos on the site that showcase more than the average workout attire...

But I noticed on the homepage there is a sticker that your site was "Safe Surf approved for children".

Curiosity grips me; did they look at the whole site, or did you add those pics later?

tia,
animgirl

[MikeParent]

Well technically, all her "naughty bits" are covered... :-)

[bigdawg]

Switzerland. Kidding but different countries have different ways of thinking [text removed] The whole thing is not a good fit from the child safe to the colors, and obsessive links. This was said to be the re-work I am glad I am not viewing the original

[animgirl]

This thread has been closed.
It has drifted off from the original thread topic; I think all our opinons have been made known concerning the original question, and the discussion has gone a bit too far.