Site revamp...

[sarab]

Folks on this forum were kind enough to offer comments on my pal Jennifer's web site design.

Here's what we've come up with, bearing in mind the consensus of opinions given.

We hope it's cleaner and less 'newbie'.

Check it out, please, at:

http://www.algarve-beach-life.com/test-page.html

The current (soon to be replaced?) page layout is typified by:

http://www.algarve-beach-life.com

We're also interested in what people think of the three styles of nav button she's come up with.

Thanks for any help, and suggestions...

SaraB

[azlatin2000]

Much better except the two different button sizes on the nav bar.

[DCElliott]

If you are going to do a makeover - don't go halfway. Do it with XHTML and CSS and you'll never look back! Folks here can help if you need it. But you have to be willing to do web tutorials and stuff to get up to speed on the terminology and basic concepts.

DE

[sarab]

Thanks for the comments so far:

Quote:
"If you are going to do a makeover - don't go halfway."

Agreed, but Jen wants to establish what would be a good visual design first, before rehashing all the tech stuff.

Quote:
"Much better except the two different button sizes on the nav bar."

Thanks for the positive note. The different buttons are there for comments on which size, colour, text people think works best. Any preferences?

I know that some designers don't like nav 'buttons' of ANY type, but when we talked it over, Jennifer thought that they were the best option for this type of site...

Then again, we're so new at this, that could be a blind alley she's talked herself into!

SaraB

[azlatin2000]

I prefer the smaller ones. The Back To Top thing at the bottom should go to the top of the page shouldn't it?

[sarab]

Quote:
"The Back To Top thing at the bottom should go to the top of the page shouldn't it?"
You're not wrong...
We messed that bit up. Luckily, it's just a 'test' page, for comments. Sloppy of us, though.

Quote:
"I prefer the smaller ones." (Buttons)
Thanks for that. We couldn't decide ouselves (but it was late, and we were wired on caffeine). :messedup:

Sara

[DCElliott]

Regarding buttons - Have you considered CSS buttons - they are easier to make and maintain in the long run. To see some examples check out my Button Page (http://www3.ns.sympatico.ca/d.elliott/buttons.html).

DE

[sarab]

Quote:
"..check out my Button page".

Thank you so much. I'll get a good look at that later, and see how much filters into my poor noddle!

Sara

[sarab]

Sad to report, Jennifer's mood was pretty low this weekend. Probably down to the amount of work she foresees in putting her site right (since it's about 28 pages now!)

Neither the current layout: http://www.algarve-beach-life.com
nor the revamp layout: http://www.algarve-beach-life.com/test-page.html
seem to receive much kudos, and I guess she's just overwhelmed.

She mentioned using the template set-ups that her host offers. They are 'customisable' up to a point, and she could use her own logo and navbar background.

She seems torn between the desire to improve her design skills, and the need to get the site looking less 'yeuchh' in the short term.

To add to her woes, the form on her 'Subscribe' page wasn't working when I checked it on my PC. And her host says it would definitely work in one of the template pages, but that there's no guarantee it'll work in her own uploaded HTML page...

Her parting thought was: maybe change the pages over to the template style and at least that way she won't be losing e-zine subscribers because her form isn't working.

We shared a curry and a bottle of wine, but she wasn't very 'up' when I left her last night. :(

What's the consensus? Short-term fix with customised templates, or lose subscribers while sorting out everything 'long-hand'?

SaraB

[MikeParent]

Fix fix fix...

[Daybreak_0]

Huh? first of all I quite like the second one over the first, and I think in general people said that.

Tell Jen to buck up.

First of all a reality check -

1) A site like this even if perfect will take time to get people to subscribe. Its a fact of life that people do not like giving their email to others, thank the spam kings for that.

2) You do not need it to be perfect all at once.

3) People who you think will not sign up just because the site does not look totally perfect are probably not worth having anyway.

In fact a site like yours, If I am interested, I would probably more likely give over my email because there are no adds, no popups, and it does not look toooo professional.


Suggestions

1) allocate an hour a week or whatever to fix your site, but do not expect miracles over night. See it as a long term project.

2) If your subscribe page does not work, use your hosts one - In other words use their template but get rid of all the other pages except the subscribe page. Link to it from your pages and over time change it to reflect your style

3) have fun - do not think of it as a chore.

4) if all the above does not help - put it aside for 2-3 weeks and not think of it at all. then come back to it.

5) And if that does not work, try 3 bottles of wine next time... :messedup:

Regards
Day

[sarab]

Thanks for the thoughtful post, Day...
I'll print it out and take it along to show Jennifer tonight. (I might take your advice on the 3 bottles too!) :cheers:

Sara

[sarab]

Just to say; Jen and I were finishing off another attempt to rehash (rather than fully redesign) her site's page layout.

So, we were feeling brave, and decided to try it in 1st Page 2000, instead of the WYSIWYG thing from her browser that she normally uses.

Briefly, it was obviously harder work, especially the tables, but we got a version done, and it sailed through the validation test, with hardly anything to change! We were both pleased with our effort (that it had worked, rather than the visual result).

So, when we've got it finalised, I'll post again for criticism.

Sorry if this is a 'nothing' post, but I guess we were just happy that we felt we'd learned something new. Our first faltering steps toward 'doing it properly' maybe?

She's decided to put the subscription form page onto a template version of her host's 'build it yourself' page, just to be sure that she doesn't miss any e-zine sign-ups. But the long-term plan is, as advised, to work at it bit-by-bit, until the site looks and operates rather better.

Thanks again for all the help, suggestions and constructive criticism from this forum.

You're all sweeties! :love:

Sara

[sarab]

Latest update:

Jennifer and I decided to bunk off work this afternoon, so we could launch the latest page layout.

This is the one we did in 1stPage2000, instead of the usual WYSIWYG thingie. I suppose we could be described as 'tired but elated'. Of course, our minor success in actually writing the thing doesn't mean it 'works'...

So... the latest version of a page layout can be seen at:

http://www.algarve-beach-life.com/new-style.html

How does it compare with the current home page? We both hope that it's 'cleaner' and it should load faster because we used text instead of button images for the navigation. (Although we didn't scrunch down that big logo image at the top, but we will when it's finalised).

We realise that this simple a site must be excruciatingly ordinary for you real designers out there, but we want to know if we're going forwards or backwards in our efforts.

Plus, Jen finished customising one of her host's template things for her e-zine Subscribe form page, just to make sure not to lose any potential subscribers. She says it's as close as she can get to the look and feel of the current site page layouts, and at least the damned thing's working. It's at:

http://www.algarve-beach-life.com/algarve-beach-lovers.html

I suppose from the point of view of those who thought the blue gradient buttons were 'icky', it at least does without them.

Thanks, as usual, for any comments, suggestions, crits and ideas.... ;)

Sara

[Daybreak_0]

I think it is a great start.

Everything easy to read, and get to. Easy to build from here.

And here is a start


http://www.sitepoint.com/article/1166

http://www.outfront.net/tutorials_02/adv_tech/funkyforms1.htm

http://www.htmlgoodies.com/beyond/cssforms.html

Regards
Day

[sarab]

Thanks once more, Day - both for the kind words and the useful URLs.
I can see our weekends are going to be busy with reading material for the foreseeable future!

Sara